Day laborers sit along a street in the Town of Guadalupe as a Maricopa County Sheriff's Office deputy drives by, Friday, July 23, 2010. The town was subject to MCSO raids before.
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So we're supposed to feel sorry for businesses that cater to illegals? That's like feeling sorry for a meth cooker when all his users get thrown in jail- If you have a business that you know has 90% illegal customers, you shouldn't have a business.
You are comparing an illegal to a meth dealer? Great critical thinking skills. Racism and hate is a wonderful thing.
I feel sorry for those illegals who have to go back to their own country, but they knew when they came here illegally that they already broke the law. They put themselves and their families in that situation. They can't blame the law, nor can they say they had not broken the law. They have to take consequences of their actions. I am an immigrant myself. I followed the law to be a United States citizen. I went to college, waited to get my H-1 visa to work, waited to get my Permanent Residency, then waited to get my Citizenship. That is the law and if you want to come here, you need to follow it.The newspaper is one sided, only showing sympathy to the illegal immigrants and how their lives are ruined. They have ruined their lives and their families' lives by breaking the law. When will the newspaper show articles from people who support the SB 1070?
Way to go hillstreet, call them a racist and hope the smear sticks. It isn't a bad tactic when your other arguments are even weaker.
I figure illegal is illegal, doesn't matter what color skin it is wrapped in. Guess that makes me a racist too.
On the other hand at least the meth cooker has a right to be in this country so maybe they have slightly higher moral ground.
Mr. Critical Thinker? (hillstreet)
Being illegal has nothing to do with racism or hatred.
You are the racist believing it is racism.
"However, TeKampe said, the "damage was already done" after then-Gov. Janet Napolitano in 1997 signed a law that cracks down on employers who hire undocumented workers."
The reporter is off by ten years. Arizona's 2007 Employer Sanctions Law went into effect on Jan. 1, 2008, and to date, two-and-a-half years later, only two businesses have faced sanctions.
Since scholars and economists (from their studies) are in disagreement with one another, only time will tell what effect a mass exodus of illegal immigrants will have on Arizona's economy.
Meanwhile, as seen by the unfavorable nationwide reaction to Arizona's SB 1070, Arizona has gained the reputation for itself as a very unwelcoming state across the board, as well as one (thanks to the trumpeting by Brewer and McCain) that is unsafe for visitors.
Besides the hit to individual businesses, I believe it will be a long time before Arizona's tourism industry recovers....regardless of what happens in the federal courts with the challenges to SB 1070.
Isn't it amazing the illegal's have been here for years but a very few of them even tried to become a citizen. As far as the children go if the parents are deported the children are citizens but the law says they can go back to mexico until they are 21 then they can come back as citizens they never lose their citizenship. so I don't know what all the boho is about, the illegals have just learnd ofer time to give a sob story to some judge that brobably didn't have any ba**s in the first place
Racism's hallmark is considering a group rather than individuals. That's why it is harmful.If you change the name of the group from Latino to 'illegal' you haven't changed what it is and why it is harmful, you merely changed the name. You don't want to call it 'racism' but it is and you know it is. The political assertions, such as they commit half the murders (when your police don't even solve half the murders), or they're all carrying drugs (like a big business is going to trust millions in merchandise to people with a fifty/fifty chance of making Tucson alive). Are pure racist propaganda, and it's rather transparent. They are people, not 'illegals' the illegality here may eventually be the politicians who violate the Constitution in order to secure re-election. And we know their names.
MS44332, I applaud you!! You did it the right and legal way. You should be extremely proud of yourself because I know it's not easy, but it CAN be done!
Good show brainfreeze!
45% of all legal Hispanic immigrants are on one or more welfare programs. Hispanics have the highest high school drop out rate, the highest birth rate and the highest welfare rate of any group in the US. WHO NEEDS IT? Who needs ANY of them? legal or illegal?
The undocumented immigrants from Mexico and other parts of Central and South America are not much different than the undocumented immigrants who came from Italy, Germany, Ireland, etc. Like the Mexican "illegals" of today, those immigrants were also treated with vicious hatred by nativists here in the U.S.
Now that our economy is in the "Great Recession", people suddenly want to find a scapegoat. The extremists who are in control of the Arizona government are happy to give the people of Arizona their scapegoat.
But most of us are descendants of "illegal aliens". Unless you are a Native American... and even they came without permission tens of thousands of years ago.
I do feel sorry for undocumented immigrants and their families.
But I feel even sorrier for the racist, xenophobic, nativist people who so bitterly hate the undocumented immigrants. You people are truly a pitiful bunch. An undocumented immigrant made the choice to come without permission for a better life. But you have made the choice to fill your hearts and minds with hatred.
Moved to Tempe in '59 and over the years interacted and knew many residents of Guadalupe. The Village was ignored until the Point S. Mtn and Ahwatukee were developed. Roads cut thru the areas. But DO NOT go there after dark.Many residents COULD have moved out (economically) but chose to remain in the culture of Yaqui Indians (refugees from Mexico). The history of the 'village' is one of isolation and preference for a 3rd world barrio life. Children (many US-born) entered Tempe schools without speaking English. One of the first ESL programs was developed and used at Frank School back in the early 1970's. Not much has changed.Many generations have lived there; many have moved out prefering to live in a cleaner, safer, Latino environment elsewhere.Guadalupe is a County Island, recently at odds with the MCSD when it came to how the law was to be enforced in their village. They have always been, and will continue to be a Sanctuary enclave. People are worried? No surprise. But, they refuse to worry about harboring illegals within their midst, they sell Western Union moneygrams and look the other way. Their economic base was/is built on the backs of people preferring to live/hide within in a 3rd world barrio.
I agree with brainfeeze.Catering to and employing illegals is a big part of the reason so many are here. If we didn't have the jobs they would go elswhere.We become so lazy and complacent and reliant on theseuntermensch, many of us and certainly most of our children won't do the work they do at any price. And by the way do you know the going rate for backhoe operator.Nice money and not that hard of jobSo my message is is: Get your kids off their I-pod addicted butts, and stop employing illegals.Above all don't feel sorry for them when they leave to go elshwere. Cheer them on and remind them that "home" is South not any other direction.
You don't say what country you emigrated from. Was it a border country? Mexico or Canada? When? Was Arizona the state you immigrated to? Or did you migrate to Arizona from another state? Are you Latino?
I (an anglo) have lived in Arizona most of my life, one who took my U.S. born citizenship for granted, had no need to learn about immigration, immigrants or immigration laws.
I have seen Arizona's mushrooming, speedy growth, particularly in the metro-Phoenix area, remember when Sky Harbor had but one very small terminal, when the 5 c's (copper, cotton, cattle, citrus and climate) identified Arizona. But it was grow, grow, grow.
It's now 20/20 hindsight, that with that growth were labor needs. Demand exceeded supply, and as we've recently learned, immigration laws were ignored and enforcement of those laws supposedly non-existent. After all, America (Arizona) was thriving. Arizona became the land of opportunity for big business, land barons, developers, the building trades, untold numbers of retailers to support the immigration from other states...and hard workers from Mexico and Latin American countries when our southern border with Mexico was virtually invisible. It is estimated that almost half of all "illegals" residing here are those who overstayed their lawfully obtained visas.
You say, "They knew when they came here illegally that they already broke the law." No, the 3-year-old of 20 years ago, now a fully Americanized college graduate ready, willing and able to contribute to our society in his/her chosen field, was not in a position to "know" he broke the law when his parent(s) were encouraged to work among us.
How many cops and law enforcement officers in the state even know what an H-1 visa is? One size does not fit all, as the authors and loud sponsor of SB 1070 with their own agenda would have you and others believe. U.S. Immigration policy and laws are complex and cover a wide range of federal domains. Every small city for whom the white-supremacist organization F.A.I.R. has written laws, under the guise of "immigration enforcement," as it did for the entire state of Arizona, has targeted Hispanics. (Hazelton, PA, Farmers Branch, TX, Valley Park, MO, Fremont, NE)Don't be fooled. SB 1070 is unworkable.
I now see a post by ArizonaLawyer and echo his throughtful remarks.
Are these Latino's illegal or are they just fed up with the Arizon law. oR DO THEY HAVE A GUILTY CONSCIENCE?
Is SB 1070 causing Latinos to leave Arizona?
More and more American farmers have moved to Mexico where they rent farm land in Mexico and get work forces for low wages. Whirlpool, Maytag appliances manufacturing, A.O. Smith Water Heaters and Electronic products are among many top U.S. companies that have moved their manufacturing to Mexico.
Today there are over 160,000 companies in the maquiladora industry in Mexico and about 3,100 plants (foreign-owned factories in Mexico at which imported parts are assembled by lower-paid workers into products for export) are operating in Mexico.
Over the years, despite that there are more U.S. farms, auto assembly manufactures, aerospace products companies that have moved to Mexico to hire workers at lower pay, more illegal immigrants come across the border into the U.S. illegally each day.
Yet you say, SB 1070 IS CAUSING Latinos to leave Arizona . . . and at the same time more companies in Mexico IS CAUSING foreign-born residents to leave Mexico and come here (illegally by law) and take jobs from the working people in America.
For someone who claims to have "moved to Tempe in '59 and over the years interacted and knew many residents of Guadalupe" and claims to "know so much" about Guadalupe, it's positively amazing that you don't know or remember of all that Guadalupe residents went through in the mid-1970's to become an incorporated town. That you don't even remember the publicity of the day in light of your "interest" in Guadalupe and its residents.
Guadalupe is NOT a "County Island." The Town of Guadalupe was granted incorporation as by the Maricopa County Board of Supervisors in 1975.
Forked - I did not realize they had incorporated, but I guess they opted NOT to build their own Police Force. Regardless, they still prefer to live in a 3rd world barrio world and their whine about the people moving back to Mexico fails to gain my sympathy.Some things never change, no matter how much lipstick you try to put on that pig.[wink]
They are leaving because Arizona said, "NO!" to the Klinton/sid-mark cartel and their patently transparent efforts to embellish the roles of sympathetic "voters." If you want them to have so much &*^&%^$ opportunity, take them home with you and foot their bills. Oh yeah, make sure only you need to display deadly force when they threaten you. Read the Immigration and Naturalization act for you liars claiming to be lawyers ...
Not unlike another 3rd world barrio, the incorporated Town of Fountain Hills, five times the population of Guadalupe and probably ten times its land area, still without its own police department.
Eight years ago when a new Fountain Hills mayor (Jon Beydler) suggested examining the idea of a police department for Fountain Hills, he was suddenly subjected to the wrath, harassment, abuse of the police power, and trumped up bogus charges of child endangerment (immediately dismissed by the court) by the town's most notorious resident, mad man Joe Arpaio. Beydler's experience was another forerunner of Arpaio's more recent vengeful actions, the nine reasons why he and his chief deputy Hendershott personally now have $46 million in claims hanging over their heads.
SargeDude, looks like you're on the sauce again.
With all decisions there is a positive and a negative. There seldom are absolutes. The illegal immigrant has been a drain on the State social services for years. The illegal immigrant also contributes to the States tax revenue through purchasing goods and services in their local community. The hardliners on both sides have failed to look at the total picture. For every action there is a reaction. AZ tax revenue is in dire straights with an over 50% deficit for 2011..... every tax dollars counts. SB 1070 is draining the State of millions in legal fees and lost business revenues. Illegals are law breakers and need to be sent home. That said, SB 1070 is a very poorly written bill that is biased based. It targets the habits and life style of the Mexican low income worker, who now legal or not won't be able to hustle work from street corners. It's easy for us with money to tell the poor they can't do something, we forget they don't have transportation; many here legal still struggle with the language, reading and speaking. Balance is key, so the hardliners on both sides, becareful what you ask for because you just might get it......
well, it looks like the bill is working right now..
Hopefully its working,the illegalls need to leave and should. The legalls are welcome and always will be.The persons who are here legally need not worry.
Az Lawyer, Take your bleeding heart and leave with the wetbcks! The immigrants you dare compare them to were hated and abused yes. However like most of your ilk you choose to ignore the fact that those immigrants came here legaly and worked for what they recieved.They didn't sneake here in the dead of night, destroy our neighborhoods and cause crime in general to rise.
Being a lawyer, speaking in half truths, lies and editing phrases, come natural to bleeding hearts. But you know that already.
I have no sympathey for the "poor latinos". They broke a basic law they get what they deserve.
"However like most of your ilk you choose to ignore the fact that those immigrants came here legally" (Actually most broke the law before they left the dock, signing up to vote with such organizations as Tammany Hall. More than a few were wanted criminals in their home country and their entry was illegal)
"and worked for what they recieved." (Actually most started on a welfare program on the Eastern or Gulf seaboard. More than half were on "the dole."
"They didn't sneake here in the dead of night, destroy our neighborhoods and cause crime in general to rise." (Actually the highest crime rate ever recorded in the United States was in the Five Points section of New York City in the 1850s, and the area was home to Irish immigrants.)
Read a little history and don't revise it to fit with the current hysterical cause.
I am amazed at the different feelings expressed as people post comments about the immigration subject. I have lived in Arizona many years and not once have I been concerned as to where my neighbors may be from. I say"hello" to everyone that I meet and consider none of them to be above me or below me. I have lived in many states as well as in Europe. I always told my kids that we would be moving to a new area and they would have the opportunity to meet people of a different culture. I always looked at our moves as a learning experience. Of course, this is not the first time that I have seen people react with hate when they are exposed to someone not of their nationality. I never look at someone as being legal or illegal. I hate to tell people that hispanics will still be working at some of their fast food restaurants and other places of business after next Thursday. That is not a magic day when all illegals will disappear from the state. As someone said earlier probably many of ancestors came as illegals. Not all came through Ellis Island as it was not opened until about 1890. We are a better country because of all the cultures who have arrived here and what they have offered to all of us.
'"I'd say that 95 percent of our business is Mexican," said Martinez, whose mother, Lupita, owns the restaurant. "And almost 90 percent of them were illegals. That's not hard math to figure out."' -- Wow, 90% of 95% are ILLEGAL ALIENS. And when MCSO looks for ILLEGAL ALIENS in that general area, that's a bad thing? Where should MCSO look for ILLEGAL ALIENS, on the top of the Superstitution Mountains?
'"Ever since the immigration topic became a hot topic two years ago, we definitely have seen a drop in some attendance in our Hispanic communities just because they're afraid to come out or let their children come to the club," Padilla said' -- The only ones that would be afraid ARE ILLEGAL ALIENS. US citizens would not have anything to fear....
"Here we are making an honest living and we're being targeted" -- Hey Montero, you started a business that YOU KNEW would/could cater to ILLEGAL ALIENS. YOUR CHOICE, amigo....
"Montero and Torres both said they know people who are planning to move away, people who have lived here a long time, who have worked hard and have no criminal histories, they said." -- Hello, their VERY PRESENCE in ILLEGAL, ergo CRIMINAL....
MS44332 -- Thanks for your input...
Rich: Try to wrap up your comments with as many words as you'd like. In the end, you are still calling people "racists" when they are not. Unfortunately, only YOU don't seem to get that FACT....
getreal2105 -- Obviously, you are a new blogger. It just so happens that Gov Brewer has already received over $1 million (last I checked) in DONATIONS to fight for SB 1070. The taxpayer hasn't paid one red cent, UNLIKE the BILLIONS we DO PAY in resources that ILLEGAL ALIENS DRAIN from our economy....
Was this article designed to incite pity for illegal aliens? Are we supposed to be upset when illegals leave?
Point to ponder: Have ANY of the pro-illegal advocates banded together to form an Adoption or Guardianship program for the citizen-kids who are here?I have never seen anything published or proposed, which is rather strange considering how these ILLEGAL parents rant about 'just wanting a better life" for their kids.Businesses: IF you have built your clientele on the ILLEGAL demographic, tough beans. (no pun intended).Where are the LEGAL American-Latinos who are fed up and ashamed of the dregs of their ethnic groups? Are they so intimidated that they can't speak up and defend THEIR America?
It's no wonder why the Tribune paper went bankrupt. The anarchist views being spread by your sensationalized news is not what most law abiding citizens want to hear. The papers WRONG VIEW that illegal immigration is not a problem, shows their lack of concern for the rule of law. Illegal immigrants are invading our nation from all over the world. Many of these invaders mean us harm. This illegal invasion needs to be stopped. In fact the law suit from the federal government over SB1070, makes the administration guilty of treason. They are supporting the actions of illegal immigrants, by stopping the US laws from being enforced by local law enforcement. This could be seen as aiding the enemy. Even though a war has not been declared on this invasion, it is an invasion non the less with 10 to 20 millions invaders already. The lack of Federal immigration enforcement has allowed this invasion to change the landscape of our entire country. Arizona is going to be mostly Hispanic VERY soon. They already out number American Indians in the state. You can drive through many parts of Phoenix and see the take over. Many neighborhoods have miles of business signs in mostly spanish, or spanish only. Many other areas of the country that have never before had much of a mexican populations are now seeing the same thing. I have no problem with Hispanic people. I do have a problem with people cheating the law, and they are the majority of the problem. The majority of Hispanics citizens I know are supportive of SB1070. They are law abiding citizens that have nothing to fear.
"Many of these invaders mean us harm."
Had you read the federal government's complaint, you would understand that this is precisely one of its points. SB 1070 contradicts federal immigration policy and laws with its perilous "one size fits all" tenets. Incarcerating thousands of undocumented immigrants whose only offense is being undocumented, at the expense of local governments, is not only impractical and unworkable given the existing state and federal resources, but it is counter to federal immigration policy, which for good reason, prioritizes enforcement against dangerous aliens.
Enforcement of SB 1070, goes even further in countering federal immigration law. It also creates state crimes and sanctions for unlawful presence despite Congress's considered judgment to NOT criminalize such status.
It is foolhardy and dangerous to treat equally an undocumented and Americanized college graduate prepared to be productive in his chosen field and a positive contributor to our society, and an undocumented murderer, rapist, or drug & human smuggler.
Yet, contrary to federal immigration policy, this is precisely what SB 1070 does.
forkedlift1 - It's now 20/20 hindsight, that with that growth were labor needs. Demand exceeded supply, and as we've recently learned, immigration laws were ignored and enforcement of those laws supposedly non-existent.
When Regan signed the last and supposedly final Immigration reform bill, we were promised the open border days were supposed to end. A wall was supposed to be built along the Mexico border. The 1.5 million estimate turned into 3 million people allowed to apply for citizenship. This bill was going to be an end to letting immigrants cheat the system.
The passage of this bill put a strain on wages in Arizona. The influx of cheaper labor caused layoffs for many higher paid American workers. This was especially true in the construction business. Homes did not get cheaper, but profits went up for builders. Many American construction workers were forced to take 20 to 50% pay cuts if they wanted to work. Please explain how that was a good thing for America, unless you were a stock holder of one of these Slimy builders? How will adding another 20 million plus to our already overburdened welfare system and new health care system help anyone in America legally?
forkedlift1 you talk about kids who have grown up and gone to school to become college graduates. In my 49 years in Arizona I have known several illegal immigrants. Not one of them went to college, and on average recent stats say 40% never even finish high school. This is the biggest reason AZ schools lead the nation in dropouts. Either way if they are not in this country legally then they are breaking the law. It IS that simple. That is the reason for the "one size fits all" tenets. You either went through the legal process have documentation, or you are illegal. In case some of you are not familiar with that term...
Dictionary.comil·le·gal /ɪˈligəl/ Show Spelled[ih-lee-guhl]–adjective1. forbidden by law or statute.2. contrary to or forbidden by official rules, regulations, etc.: The referee ruled that it was an illegal forward pass.–noun3. Informal . illegal alien.
We all know that ICE is under bodied and under brained, but that can be solved. In fact they could be cut out of the system. If we don't have to worry about attempting to grade the treat and crimes of the immigrant, which is the purpose of ICE, then we can just start putting them on buses back home. I am sick of hearing how hard it will be to make all of these people leave. Seems to me we have a 9.5% unemployment rate that could be helped greatly by putting some of these people in temporary positions assisting with the deportations. That is the only area of government growth most people would agree with, and only on a temporary basis. After these people get done removing the illegals there should be lots of open jobs these people vacated. If Mexico gets all of these educated people back then maybe they can help make Mexico a better place. Mexico surely needs a larger educated class if they want to come out of the stone age.
forkbent: Were you born a bleeding heart socialist liberal or did you migrate to it? :-) You lack substance in your arguments. You fail to knock the sanctuary cities that the feds are protecting that certainly run counter to federal law. You gloss over the tax burden that i suppose even you pay. Precisely how is SB 1070 impeding the federal government who are not doing their job in the first place? Now, for the real kicker that you and azparalegal can answer for us; Do you really think another amnesty program will stop illegal immigration? I think we all would like to see the two of you put your heads together and answer that question.
I think I understand where you're coming from (below). What I do not understand is HOW you "have known" several illegal immigrants. Neighbors? On the job? Under what circumstances have you "known" them? How did you "know" they were illegal immigrants? Did they openly tell you?You must associate with a great number of all Hispanics since you said the majority of those you "know" support SB 1070.
BTW, are YOU a college graduate?
"In my 49 years in Arizona I have known several illegal immigrants. Not one of them went to college"
'their lack of concern for the rule of law"
"This illegal invasion needs to be stopped."
"A wall was supposed to be built along the Mexico border"
"the law suit from the federal government over SB1070, makes the administration guilty of treason"
"... stopping the US laws from being enforced by local law enforcement. This could be seen as aiding the enemy."
"Even though a war has not been declared on this invasion, it is an invasion non the less"
"The majority of Hispanics citizens I know are supportive of SB1070. They are law abiding citizens that have nothing to fear."
"we can just start putting them on buses back home. I am sick of hearing how hard it will be to make all of these people leave."
"(summary) illegal is illegal"
"After these people get done removing the illegals there should be lots of open jobs these people vacated."
Either your active imagine got the best of you or you're confusing me with someone else."The two of you"??? "You and azparalegal"??? Sorry to disappoint you, but I don't collaborate with anyone when offering comments and opinions on this website. And I've never even seen a screen name "azparalegal," much less being familiar with any comment(s) by that party.
However, you indicate that YOU are one who employs "groupthink" -- apparently a needed lifeline to validate whatever you express in your posts. You said, "WE ALL would like to see the two of you put your heads together and answer that question." We all???
Legal scholars, prosecutors and top law enforcement officials have been analyzing, diagnosing and drawing conclusions about SB 1070 for three months now. Provided the judge doesn't enjoin all or parts of it, it will go into effect on Thursday. Only time will tell how it plays out and what comes of it.
I forgive you your bad habit of labeling. I know by now that you can't help yourself.
Buh-bye illegals...and buh-bye to businesses who cater to them.
Hey, Arizona Lawyer- I'd bet you make money off illegals- right? The difference between illegal immigrants and those who came lawfully is just that- LAWFUL...perhaps you were absent the day they taught about that word in "law school".
In answer to your question "Is SB1070 causing Latinos to leave Arizona?" HOPEFULLY!
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